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Discussion: Yes: 90125

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Post by jackan October 3, 2014 (11 of 23)
MichaelCPE said:

The DR list - http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=yes&album=90125 - says to me that the original CD pressing or the HDTracks would be the way to go.

Yikes!

Post by Claude October 3, 2014 (12 of 23)
The first CD release was a so-called "Target" CD (because of the disc design), which are now valuable collectibles.

It was among the first CDs I bought, in 1986.

Unfortunately, my CD isn't worth anything today. After having listened to it about a hundred times (it was one of my demo CDs, because of the impressive sound effects on "Leave it"), I was so fed up with the music and thought I would never want to hear it again. I was much more into jazz by then.

One evening in 1990 in our student home, with quite some alcohol involved, someone brought up the topic of CD error correction, whether a scratched CD would really still play fine, as the music industry claimed. I said I had a CD to spare, so we threw the 90125 Target CD several times against the wall and walked over it. It looked awful, but it still played, although the laser made a lot of noise.

24 years alter, I bought the album again, on HDtracks, as a guilty pleasure. I also still have the scratched CD, but I don't think I'll put it into my player.

Post by rammiepie October 3, 2014 (13 of 23)
So it seems that the Warner's YES SACD High Vibration box set (which, thankfully, I passed on) has exceedingly low DR scores.

At least the Steve Wilson remixes have decent but not especially high DR scores, as well.

Could that have something to do with the age and/or overuse of the master tapes?

Post by Solo man October 3, 2014 (14 of 23)
I used to have the High Vibration boxed set but sold it because it got a great offer on it. I couldn't keep it because the sound was too compressed and loud. I just couldn't get into this boxed set but my favourite album is 90125.

IMO, this SACD sounds the same as the one in the boxed set. Also, can anyone help me replace the pictures of the front and back of this SACD. I took the pic with the wrapper still on and realize that I should have taken it without the cellophane wrapper. When I submitted this to SA-CD.net, I didn't realize it would look like this.

Post by MichaelCPE October 3, 2014 (15 of 23)
rammiepie said:

So it seems that the Warner's YES SACD High Vibration box set (which, thankfully, I passed on) has exceedingly low DR scores.

At least the Steve Wilson remixes have decent but not especially high DR scores, as well.

Could that have something to do with the age and/or overuse of the master tapes?

Apparently Eddie Offord who recorded early '70's Yes used (for the time) lots of analogue compression.

Hence I think there isn't lots of missing dynamics in the mulit-tracks or master tapes.

But this still leave us, in the case of The Yes Album with a DR of 13 (on the blu-ray) which by today's standards is a recording with excellent dynamics.

Post by rammiepie October 3, 2014 (16 of 23)
Yes' 90125 album was recorded in 1983 and it's not surprising that the 1984 RBCD and '83 Vinyl pressings possess the highest DR ratings. OTOH, the High Vibration SACD Warner's remaster has the lowest scores which suggests that in no way were the original mastertapes accessed.

And, Yes, I agree: the SW Yes album BD~A sounds fantastic, especially in mch!

Post by MichaelCPE October 3, 2014 (17 of 23)
I think what usually happens these days is the owner of the master tapes makes a high-resolution digital copy, and this is what is sent to those who remaster.

In Stephen Wilson's case he gets sent a high-resolution copy of the multi-track tapes as well.

The Japanese could well have used a flat high-resolution digital version of the master tape as their starting point.

Their 'sin' is that they decided that this would sound better if they compressed it to within an inch of its life and added some smiley EQ so people could rave about the clear top end and stronger bass.

Post by Johnno October 9, 2014 (18 of 23)
Very sad. I know what I'm about to say will probably be met with some derision but most of the pop/rock SACDs I have have been poorly produced - and I wonder why I continue to buy them!! Hoping for a miracle I suppose. 'The 'Dead Can Dance' set is the only exception, in my opinion, and it's superb so it can be done.

Post by MichaelCPE October 9, 2014 (19 of 23)
Agreement from me.

I have the Dead Can Dance and they are done well.

What is silly is that as that though blu-ray / SACD / DVD-Audio has the greatest potential dynamics and vinyl the least (with CD midway) the music industry is releasing lots of content where the vinyl has wider dynamics than the hi-rez format.

Fortunately there are a few notable exceptions. The Stephen Wilson Yes blu-rays have the same dynamics as the master tapes.

Post by sylvian October 9, 2014 (20 of 23)
I thought that 90125 has been taken as 48/16 DDD on a DAT. So this might be cause, that this album might not sound as good as the other ones. AFAIK with Big Generator the band returned to complete analogue recording.

So it might not be useful to whining over SQ of 90125 being a part of the box set or released separately, IMHO.

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