Thread: Blu-ray audio

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Post by sabbath October 3, 2008 (1 of 23)
I just bought a SA-CD player (Sony SCD-CE595 from Best Buy) and some hybrid cds (from BMG Music Service). But I'm wondering if Blu-ray audio is gonna make the SA-CD format obsolete? A SA-CD has 4.7gb-8.5gb and a Blu-ray has 25gb-50gb, so if I buy a bunch of SA-CD's now will they be obsolete in a years time? Have any of the music companies said they will bypass SA-CD for Blu-ray Audio?

Post by DSD October 3, 2008 (2 of 23)
sabbath said:

I just bought a SA-CD player (Sony SCD-CE595 from Best Buy) and some hybrid cds (from BMG Music Service). But I'm wondering if Blu-ray audio is gonna make the SA-CD format obsolete? A SA-CD has 4.7gb-8.5gb and a Blu-ray has 25gb-50gb, so if I buy a bunch of SA-CD's now will they be obsolete in a years time? Have any of the music companies said they will bypass SA-CD for Blu-ray Audio?

BluRay is mostly a video format. 2L has a combo SACD BluRay disc out Divertimenti - TrondheimSolistene which has gotten excellent reviews.

The main difference I see is BluRay offers up to 192kHz PCM with up to 7.1 channels and SACD is from DSD which I am many others believe is superior to even the highest resolution PCM. What the record companies are going to do is anyones guess?

Post by trntbl October 3, 2008 (3 of 23)
sabbath said:

I just bought a SA-CD player (Sony SCD-CE595 from Best Buy) and some hybrid cds (from BMG Music Service). But I'm wondering if Blu-ray audio is gonna make the SA-CD format obsolete? A SA-CD has 4.7gb-8.5gb and a Blu-ray has 25gb-50gb, so if I buy a bunch of SA-CD's now will they be obsolete in a years time? Have any of the music companies said they will bypass SA-CD for Blu-ray Audio?

Yes, of course they will be obsolete. And quess what, the BluRay will become obsolete even sooner than SACD as there is no reason to buy movies in any physical medium in few years. But lucky for you, you have time to collect bunch of SACD before this happens and enjoy them for the good part of your life. I´m just enjoying my obsolete LPs, BTW.

kristian

Post by dobyblue October 3, 2008 (4 of 23)
DSD said:

BluRay is mostly a video format. 2L has a combo SACD BluRay disc out Divertimenti - TrondheimSolistene which has gotten excellent reviews.

The main difference I see is BluRay offers up to 192kHz PCM with up to 7.1 channels and SACD is from DSD which I am many others believe is superior to even the highest resolution PCM. What the record companies are going to do is anyones guess?

Blu-ray is only spec'd for 24/192 up to 5.1
7.1 can be done at a maximum resolution of 24/96

The record companies will be pushing Blu-ray Audio discs sometime heading into Christmas 2009 or immediately thereafter once Blu-ray has a stronger foothold. That is what I have gathered with discussions with the new technology department at SonyBMG; all the four majors are on the same page, much as the major studios are. There is a massive opportunity here for them soon approaching.

The benefits?
1) Anyone with a Blu-ray Video Disc player will be able to play Blu-ray Audio discs. No need to buy a new player for an "audio" format.
2) Additional content - from downloadable content eliminating double dipping (see Neil Young's statments on the Archive series) to high definition video content (band videos, backstage/making of stuff) with massive room for extras

Post by dobyblue October 3, 2008 (5 of 23)
sabbath said:

I just bought a SA-CD player (Sony SCD-CE595 from Best Buy) and some hybrid cds (from BMG Music Service). But I'm wondering if Blu-ray audio is gonna make the SA-CD format obsolete? A SA-CD has 4.7gb-8.5gb and a Blu-ray has 25gb-50gb, so if I buy a bunch of SA-CD's now will they be obsolete in a years time? Have any of the music companies said they will bypass SA-CD for Blu-ray Audio?

They're not going to blow up - I wouldn't be concerned with obsolecense.
There are many SACD's to choose from an very reasonable prices and the aural reward is beyond monetary value.

Check out Amazon's marketplace, Best Buy, Acoustic Sounds, etc; there's plenty to choose from and you're going to wait another year at least to see content on Blu-ray.

Once you've heard Billy Joel's "The Stranger" on SACD, it's hard to imagine life without it.

SACD rocks, enjoy it!

Post by RWetmore October 3, 2008 (6 of 23)
I think Blu-ray is likely to be around and coexist with downloads for at least 10 years (maybe 20 or more), so it could pose a threat to SACD, especially since all blu-ray players will be able to play the discs.

Will classical and jazz move away from SACD in favor of Blu-ray audio discs? I think they could if audio on blu-ray gains more market share than SACD, and with SACDs market share as tiny as it is, surpassing it won't take much.

However, this all depends on how the format is designed. If I can't just pop in the disc and play it without the use of video menus, Blu-ray audio is doomed and will go absolutely nowhere, IMO. They should call it Blu-ray CD or BD-CD with simple stereo and multichannel. Plus with "CD" in the name everyone will immediately "get it" and understand exactly what it is and what it does. There is no need to include video in the spec because anyone can just do a regular video disc with high quality audio if that's what they want.

Post by The Seventh Taylor October 4, 2008 (7 of 23)
As I've argued before, the technical 'constraints' of SACD are not the cause of its niche existence -- the consumers' and record companies' apathy are. Any new attempt at a high-resolution surround sound format that fails to address these issues is doomed.

Post by raffells October 4, 2008 (8 of 23)
RWetmore said:

I think Blu-ray is likely to be around and coexist with downloads for at least 10 years (maybe 20 or more), so it could pose a threat to SACD, especially since all blu-ray players will be able to play the discs.

Will classical and jazz move away from SACD in favor of Blu-ray audio discs? I think they could if audio on blu-ray gains more market share than SACD, and with SACDs market share as tiny as it is, surpassing it won't take much.

However, this all depends on how the format is designed. If I can't just pop in the disc and play it without the use of video menus, Blu-ray audio is doomed and will go absolutely nowhere, IMO. They should call it Blu-ray CD or BD-CD with simple stereo and multichannel. Plus with "CD" in the name everyone will immediately "get it" and understand exactly what it is and what it does. There is no need to include video in the spec because anyone can just do a regular video disc with high quality audio if that's what they want.

Whilst I agree in general with some of your comments as Im Not sure if all current players can play sacd layers? just the CD layer.Maybe in the future.
The user pattern is more likely to be noticed when current sacd players need replacing.In that case the ten year period will be shorter when you look at the sacd lazer problems ie Sony and Denon machines in particular .
As regards the naming/title. Look at the current confusion with Dvd-A dvda,Dvd audio and audio DVD and you will see they all get confused.So One blueray or is it Blue-ray? name to cover everything is a better option.
I still think video is a pop music market.

Post by Sam October 4, 2008 (9 of 23)
This has all been done before. DVD, remember? With video, without video, with CD, without CD, etc.

Blu-ray is just a better DVD. It's not going to rejuvenate music sales, or replace CD or SACD (downloads will, someday).

Post by Peter October 4, 2008 (10 of 23)
RWetmore said:

....Will classical and jazz move away from SACD in favor of Blu-ray audio discs? I think they could if audio on blu-ray gains more market share than SACD, and with SACDs market share as tiny as it is, surpassing it won't take much.....

Although I agree with much of what you've written, I diverge with you on the above, though the situation contains a lots of ifs and buts.

Apparently SACD was marketed at great expense, though, in my opinion, not for long enough. In an economic malaise, the first thing to go is advertising, and I have to say that failure of some of the so-called majors to persevere with SACD does not fill me with confidence about their doing any better with BR.

To repeat what I wrote much earlier in another thread: I have supported SACD since the release of MTT's Mahler 6. I'm not inclined to act as pioneer fodder for Universal and Naxos (to name but two) until they show they have the balls to market BR and succeed.

A BR player isn't on my wish-list at the moment.

Peter

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