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Discussion: Rachmaninov: Piano Concerto No. 2, Moments Musicaux - Lazic, Petrenko

Posts: 33
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Post by andrewb November 15, 2008 (1 of 33)
Beware the concerto on this disc is taken from live performances and includes applause! The applause has not been given a separate track.

There is no mention on the disc packaging, nor as far as I can see on the Channel Classics web site, that it was recorded from live and worst of all that the applause has been retained.
There are also some coughs and at one point in the first movement someone, very briefly, seems to begin speaking (at 8' 08'').

If I had known this disc had applause I would never have purchased it. Now I have two versions of the second with applause, the other being the Hough on Hyperion. For me this disc was a complete waste of money, I'll have to go back to the Ashkenazy/Previn recordings.
Purely as a performance the Hough is, in my view, to be preferred over this one by Lazic.

Why cannot record companies always say when a recording has been taken from live? At least then one can be more cautious about purchase and check whether applause is present or not.

Post by Windsurfer November 15, 2008 (2 of 33)
Each to his (or her) own. But I really cannot comprehend why anyone would be annoyed by applause at the end of a live recorded concert. I particularly ENJOY the experience of a well recorded live concert where I hear the same rustlings, coughs and other clues that create the illusion that I am hearing music in a much larger space than the room I am sitting in.

The applause at the end seem natural to me....unless it is unnaturally truncated too soon. It seems to work particularly well where an encore is played - that gives a real feeling participating in a live event.

Post by andrewb November 15, 2008 (3 of 33)
Windsurfer said:

Each to his (or her) own.

True, but surely there should be some indication from a record company that the recording is live and preferably also whether it has applause or not. Then an informed choice can be made about purchase according to ones preference.

I don't mind applause when attending a live performance or even on a DVD but I find it hideous when it ends an audio only recording.

Post by zeus November 15, 2008 (4 of 33)
andrewb said:

There is no mention on the disc packaging, nor as far as I can see on the Channel Classics web site, that it was recorded from live and worst of all that the applause has been retained.

Channel Classics' site clearly notes this is a live recording (see Inlay). This is the reason I provide links to the label site directly in the title entry so people can find more details, listen to sound samples etc. Personally I don't see what the fuss is about. If it was a live recording and there was NO applause maybe caution would be advised :-).

Post by DSD November 15, 2008 (5 of 33)
andrewb said:

Beware the concerto on this disc is taken from live performances and includes applause! The applause has not been given a separate track.

There is no mention on the disc packaging, nor as far as I can see on the Channel Classics web site, that it was recorded from live and worst of all that the applause has been retained.
There are also some coughs and at one point in the first movement someone, very briefly, seems to begin speaking (at 8' 08'').

If I had known this disc had applause I would never have purchased it. Now I have two versions of the second with applause, the other being the Hough on Hyperion. For me this disc was a complete waste of money, I'll have to go back to the Ashkenazy/Previn recordings.
Purely as a performance the Hough is, in my view, to be preferred over this one by Lazic.

Why cannot record companies always say when a recording has been taken from live? At least then one can be more cautious about purchase and check whether applause is present or not.

Andrewb I love live classical recordings and I love applause, if the performance is really good I often join in. But I agree live recordings should be noted on the packaging.

I don't understand why you would want the applause on a separate track? I would think it should at the conclusion of the piece where it actually occurred?

Also I would consider the deletion of applause from a live recording to be undo tampering, and a crime!

I have Hough's Rachmaninoff Piano Concertos on Hyperion and enjoy them very much! The back of the SACD clearly states: "The four concertos were recorded live in concerts at the Eugene McDermott Concert Hall, Morton H Meyerson Symphony Centerm Dallas"

I am curious as to what is exactly wrong with applause in a live recording? At least in a classical concert the audience does actually wait until the music has ended before applauding. I am really confused on your position?

Post by Windsurfer November 15, 2008 (6 of 33)
Hi Theresa,

As I have already indicated, I also lifted my eyebrows at this, but other's comments on this forum from time to time indicate that Andrewb really isn't alone. I suspect you and I may be in a minority here.

Bruce

Post by Tootsie November 15, 2008 (7 of 33)
Windsurfer said:

... I suspect you and I may be in a minority here.

Bruce

You can count me in that minority. I also like applauds at the end of live recordings, especially in mch as it gives you the feeling of "being there" and participating at the event.
For the Rach 2nd, i have the Hough and the Van Cliburn versions. I can tell you that I listen more often to the Hough one.

Post by andrewb November 16, 2008 (8 of 33)
zeus said:

Channel Classics' site clearly notes this is a live recording (see Inlay).

I looked on the Channel Classics web site before purchasing and could not find any mention of it being a live recording.
If one opens the Channel home page and then clicks on the link for the Lazic recording I could find no mention, on the page that opens, of it being live.
I have now looked again and have found it where you say, presumably it was always there, however I find it very obscurely placed. The whole web page has very poor readability and really needs improving, particularly the description of the disc contents.

Post by wolfE November 16, 2008 (9 of 33)
I have been looking forward to this release with high expectattions, because there are only few Rach 2 in good sound quality. I think, this is a DSD recording. So please some comments concerning interpretation and sound quality!

Post by aoqd22 November 16, 2008 (10 of 33)
Andrewb

Firstly as far as the disc you have bought is concerned if there was nothing visible via the front or back of the jewel case (which I presume was shrinkwrapped at the time of purchase) to indicate a live recording then you have every right IMHO to return it to the seller saying sorry but not fit for purpose!

I have tended to avoid discs recorded live. I would have preferred Hough's Rach concertos set to have been issued without the applause but admit on the other hand I find the audience participation in Davis' splendid Verdi Falstaff on LSO Live adds to the enjoyment. When it comes to the applause on Haitink's rather good RCO Live disc of Mahler 4 well I think it should have been separately banded.

OK call me fikkle!

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