Thread: RIP Elliot Carter

Posts: 35
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Post by rammiepie November 7, 2012 (21 of 35)
Euell Neverno said:

Of those, Adams writes some nice stuff.

Agreed, but I'm surprised you're not a staunch admirer of Stockhausen's blips, beeps and Concerto for K~Y Jelly?

Post by ramesh November 7, 2012 (22 of 35)
My preferred modern music for the past day has been to listen to Karl Rove on Fox News deny that Obama was winning the presidency even when the Fox News 'fair and balanced' analysis team called the presidency for Obama.

I'll get back to the 11 Elliott Carter CDs I have after I've finished the Schadenfreude :-)

Post by TerraEpon November 7, 2012 (23 of 35)
Lochiel said:

John Williams is a great example of someone who is a truly gifted composer of tuneful, enjoyable music. Why isn't he writing symphonies?

Williams has written quite a large amount of 'concert' music. He especially likes writing concerti (at the minimum, flute, violin, clarinet, horn, harp, tuba, cello, and bassoon). Much of it is far less tuneful than [most of] his film music, though a lot of it is still enjoyable (the tuba concerto is a great piece and on a BIS SACD).

Post by Lochiel November 8, 2012 (24 of 35)
Polarius T said:

Literacy and education really are going downhill.

So I guess Brahms and Beethoven weren't intelligent, then?

I don't understand your point. It sounds like you're insinuating that the quotient of someone's intelligence and literacy is predicted by the scale of their appreciation for the "music" of Elliott Carter.

Some people find beauty in the solutions to calculus problems - but not many...

Post by jdaniel November 8, 2012 (25 of 35)
Lochiel said:

So I guess Brahms and Beethoven weren't intelligent, then?

I don't understand your point. It sounds like you're insinuating that the quotient of someone's intelligence and literacy is predicted by the scale of their appreciation for the "music" of Elliott Carter.

Some people find beauty in the solutions to calculus problems - but not many...

Think of Mozart's PC 21 2nd mov't: the "simple" outlining of a triad. Does an appreciation reveal...what?

Post by jdaniel November 8, 2012 (26 of 35)
Polarius T said:

Sometimes I honestly don't know what to say after reading what people write on this forum.

I'm going to start a new thread on nonsense in a day or two so we can at least stay respectful of certain thread topics and people can unburden and express themselves freely in more appropriate contexts.

RIP indeed Elliott Carter, one of the uncreative minds of our time, with just 55 or so published works to his name after turning 90. Now can we go back to John Williams, his melody, harmony, and rhythm that one can parse even when able to count to just two. So tuneful, so true, and made with the masses in mind. See you soon at the movie theater near you in between the advertisement ditties.

Literacy and education really are going downhill.

Substitute Carter for Reger: every last note justified, could spit out fugues like a Univac 2001, unfailing taste, admirably-high compositional standards... Are dumb people still "simply not ready" or "literate enough" for Reger?

Post by Polly Nomial November 8, 2012 (27 of 35)
Lochiel said:

Some people find beauty in the solutions to calculus problems - but not many...

Only every single person that uses this site, the SACD medium, DVD, BD, computers, mobile phones. No, not many.

Never mind literacy, lack of scientific education is a far bigger problem IMO.

Post by Euell Neverno November 8, 2012 (28 of 35)
Compositional complexity and musicality don't necessarily equate. Coltrane's "A Love Supreme," often cited as his finest work is for most not easily reduced to the emotional connection we associate with music. I'm not sure why Reger is cited above, but the complexity of his orchestrations often results in a density that obscures the inner voices.

Understanding of compositional principles and techniques is certainly rewarding, but I personally subscribe to the hard-wired theory, which holds that appreciation of music is a natural thing that most share and, even with respect to less accessible compositions, repeated listening can make that emotional connection. Of course, as stated above, complexity does not equal merit. When we experience an epiphany concerning a rhythmic or harmonic device used by a composer, that is merely an intellectual exercise that may or may not result in an emotional connection.

Attack away --

Post by rammiepie November 8, 2012 (29 of 35)
Euell Neverno said:

Compositional complexity and musicality don't necessarily equate. Coltrane's "A Love Supreme," often cited as his finest work is for most not easily reduced to the emotional connection we associate with music. I'm not sure why Reger is cited above, but the complexity of his orchestrations often results in a density that obscures the inner voices.

Understanding of compositional principles and techniques is certainly rewarding, but I personally subscribe to the hard-wired theory, which holds that appreciation of music is a natural thing that most share and, even with respect to less accessible compositions, repeated listening can make that emotional connection. Of course, as stated above, complexity does not equal merit. When we experience an epiphany concerning a rhythmic or harmonic device used by a composer, that is merely an intellectual exercise that may or may not result in an emotional connection.

Attack away --

+1

IMO, a pretty girl is like a melody and a complex, atonal musical composition is like a "broad" who gives you nothing but "agita."

Post by Fugue November 8, 2012 (30 of 35)
In an attempt to steer this thread back on track, here's an interesting article on Carter's music:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/tomserviceblog/2012/apr/30/guide-contemporary-music-elliott-carter

(Carter was still alive when the article was written.)

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