Thread: 1st Post - Oppo DV980H SACD DSD to which DSD enabled A/V Receiver?

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Post by luvcalifornia November 25, 2008 (71 of 94)
I have the Oppo 980H hooked up to my Yamaha RX-V1800 Receiver ($999.00) and love it. The SACD sends DSD over the HDMI cable, also DVD-Audio. Make sure the output is set up correctly on the Oppo player, this gave me the most trouble.

Mark

Post by poochie November 27, 2008 (72 of 94)
Hi, this is my first post. What does it mean when Onkyo lists "DSD Processing / Direct Mode" in the specs for the 876? Only "DSD Processing" is listed in the specs for the 806. What is the DSD Direct mode on the 876?

Post by dobyblue December 2, 2008 (73 of 94)
poochie said:

Hi, this is my first post. What does it mean when Onkyo lists "DSD Processing / Direct Mode" in the specs for the 876? Only "DSD Processing" is listed in the specs for the 806. What is the DSD Direct mode on the 876?

They may list Direct Mode in the specs, but the 806, 876 and 906 all convert DSD to PCM regardless of setting, so the differences are fairly irrelevant.

The 805, 875 and 905 all convert DSD directly to analog in DIRECT MODE, so if you've got a transport like the Oppo 980H or Pioneer ELITE DV-48 you're better off looking for one generation ago there. The 805 is only $600 right now.

Post by pbulghe December 17, 2008 (74 of 94)
I have an oppo 980h, which a/v receiver should i buy to listen sacd through hdmi? I saw denon 1909 seems preety nice but i dont know if accepts dsd via hdmi, need help

Post by dobyblue December 17, 2008 (75 of 94)
pbulghe said:

I have an oppo 980h, which a/v receiver should i buy to listen sacd through hdmi? I saw denon 1909 seems preety nice but i dont know if accepts dsd via hdmi, need help

I believe with Denon you need to get up to the 2809CI to start getting DSD>Analog conversion.

Post by lenb April 19, 2009 (76 of 94)
With an Oppo DV980H sending DSD via HDMI...

The Denon AVR-2809CI (and slightly older, but apparently just
as good AVR-2808CI) has a "PURE DIRECT" mode that will
convert DSD directly to analog w/o an intermediate PCM conversion.

So far so good.

I've got a nice Velodyne DD-15 sub, and would like to use
relatively small satellites to save space -- particularly if I go
multi-channel and get 3 or 5 of them:-)

So will Denon's PURE DIRECT mode work with a system that is a
subwoofer + small satellites -- or would it route stereo SACD
just to the L/R and the sub would be quiet?

This question applies to multi-channel also.
While DSOTM is clearly advertised as 5.1 channnels --
presumably with the .1 getting send straight to the subwoofer --
some SACD multi-channel appear to be 3-channel, eg
Miles David - Kind of Blue. I assume this is 3.0 (ie L/C/R)
rather than 2.1 (ie. L/R + sub). So will PURE DIRECT mode
use the subwoofer for a 3.0 SACD?

If the answer is no, that PURE DIRECT DSD in the receiver
gets routed only to the satellites unless there is an explicit .1
track on the SACD, then I'd either need to get full range
satellites, or use PCM surround processing to enable my sub,
which would be either expensive or sub-optimal.

A second question. I see no mention on this thread of
the new Sony STR-DA4400ES (or the older STR-DA5300ES),
both which clearly advertise the ability to accept DSD via HDMI.
Is anybody using them? Do they convert to PCM on the way to analog?

Post by lenb April 21, 2009 (77 of 94)
Denon Tech support answered about PURE DIRECT on the AVR-2909CI:

"When using the 7.1 EXT IN from an SACD, the Pure Direct option is not available because the signal is already going into the receiver with each individual channel processed by the source. However, to improve audio from any other input on the receiver you can activate Pure Direct, which will provide the purest 2 channel audio. If you would like to use the subwoofer in pure direct, this receiver allows to customize 2 channel direct and add a subwoofer. (page 30 of the manual)"

Indeed, page 30 of http://www.usa.denon.com/AVR-2809CI-OM-E_102A.pdf
shows options for "2ch Direct/Stereo" that can select front: (large/small)
sub (yes/no) sub mode (lfe/lfe+main) -- whatever that is -- and crossover
(40/60/80/90/100.../250Hz) yay!

I guess I didn't notice it because I was searching for "pure" in the manual
rather than "direct"...

So SACD DSD stereo looks good. Multi-channel with *.1 channels is
also supported. I'm still unclear what would happen to the sub on a 3.0 mix...

While waiting for an answer, I researched the Yamaha RX-V1900
(and again, the apparently equivalent 2008 model, RX-V1800)
since it also accepts DSD over HDMI and has a "Pure Direct Mode"
for with DSD->analog w/o an intermediate PCM conversion.
It's manual under DIRECT "2ch Stereo" only, says:
"The low-frequency signals of both front left and right channels are redirected to the subwoofer in the following cases:

- LFE/BASS OUT is set to BOTH
- FRONT SP are set to SMALL and LFE/BASE OUT is set to SWFR"

The Yamaha also has a selectable subwoofer crossover, similar to the Denon.

So I'm undecided between the Denon AVR-2908CI, AVR-2909CI
and the Yamaha RX-V1800, RX-V1900.

They both handle DSD over HDMI, convert DSD->Analog w/o an
intermediate PCM conversion, and can handle a subwoofer and
satellite setup in pure 2-channel mode, support bi-amp on the fronts
using the unused rear channel amplifiers,
and also support DSD multi-channel if I go that route.

0.04% vs 0.09% THD -- meaningful or meaningless?

Are there any folks in the forum using them for DSD this way that can
share their impressions, or should I decide now just by price?

Post by rosenkavalier817 July 28, 2009 (78 of 94)
Maybe someone here can answer my question. I have the Oppo 980 and Onkyo SR705. They're hooked up via HDMI. When I listen to a MCH DSD SACD I can choose the DSD listening mode, but when listening to any of my stereo DSD SACDs, that listening mode is unavailable. Am I missing something? Thanks so much.

Post by Fitzcaraldo215 July 28, 2009 (79 of 94)
rosenkavalier817 said:

Maybe someone here can answer my question. I have the Oppo 980 and Onkyo SR705. They're hooked up via HDMI. When I listen to a MCH DSD SACD I can choose the DSD listening mode, but when listening to any of my stereo DSD SACDs, that listening mode is unavailable. Am I missing something? Thanks so much.

I do not know your Onkyo, but I have an Integra DTC 9.8, which might have similarities. I used to use an Oppo 980, now BDP-83. I assume you have selected DSD output via HDMI on the Oppo. I futher assume that when listening to Mch SACD's, it is the display on the Onkyo that says DSD.

What does it say when listening to a stereo SACD or switching the Oppo to the SACD stereo "layer"? Does it say something like Dolby PL2X or some other listening mode? If so, it is a setup issue in your Onkyo, which causes a stereo signal via the HDMI input to default to a non-stereo listening mode. That HDMI input has been assigned a source name like DVD or CD or something you assigned it to. You need to find this in the Onkyo setup menus and change the default to stereo for stereo inputs via this source. I believe this might solve your problem.

Post by rosenkavalier817 July 28, 2009 (80 of 94)
Fitzcaraldo215 said:

I do not know your Onkyo, but I have an Integra DTC 9.8, which might have similarities. I used to use an Oppo 980, now BDP-83. I assume you have selected DSD output via HDMI on the Oppo. I futher assume that when listening to Mch SACD's, it is the display on the Onkyo that says DSD.

What does it say when listening to a stereo SACD or switching the Oppo to the SACD stereo "layer"? Does it say something like Dolby PL2X or some other listening mode? If so, it is a setup issue in your Onkyo, which causes a stereo signal via the HDMI input to default to a non-stereo listening mode. That HDMI input has been assigned a source name like DVD or CD or something you assigned it to. You need to find this in the Onkyo setup menus and change the default to stereo for stereo inputs via this source. I believe this might solve your problem.

Thanks Fitz. Your assumptions are exactly correct. The only thing I could find on the Onkyo like you mentioned is the Listening Presets for the audio sources. I played around with those, but wasn't able to fix it. A DSD source is set to the DSD mode and that's it. I'll keep playing and see what I find. Thanks!

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